Negotiating before accepting offers?

Summary:

How do you do it?

Negotiating before accepting offers?

Myname (guest) 05 Jan 2010 17:02

If you have an offer from a research university how much can you negotiate (e.g., higher salary, bigger start-up package, less teaching)?

Do you need to take a firm line (e.g., I won't take less than XYZ)?

How do you use other offers to up your favorite offer (e.g., do you show them your other offers?)?

If you have other interviews how can you use that to your advantage?

Thanks.

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

Anon76 (guest) 05 Jan 2010 19:37

I think they expect you to negotiate. I don't think you should take a firm line, but let them know that in order to be productive with your research you will need xyz (research costs, student assistant pay, summer salary, etc). I wouldn't show them your other offers, but rather draw up a budget for the equipment and salary you need. Most places are simply used to this sort of thing and expect to receive something like this. You can let them know that you have other offers, for example if you are negotiating with your top choice for summer salary and another place offers a higher summer salary, then use that number to negotiate with your top choice. Most of my colleagues who recently took tt jobs sent me their start-up package lists - these had itemized expenses for lab equipment, personnel salary, office supplies, summer salary and even reduced teaching load requests. Just put it all down on paper and see what they say. Worse case scenario, they say no. Good luck! How exciting to be in the negotiation phase!

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

Anon (guest) 05 Jan 2010 20:54

First - I made a spreadsheet where I outlined all of my start-up requests. I put everything I could possibly think of and tried to overestimate what I would need as much as possible. Luckily, my start up package was pretty good. For salary, I didn't have another offer in hand, but requested more. First I asked whether salary WAS negotiable because it was lower than I expected. (The chair responded something like thinking the salary was reasonable but wondered what I had in mind.) Then I made a request for more - because I didn't have a counter-offer in hand I went by the APA salary survey (http://www.apa.org/workforce/publications/index.aspx) for assistant faculty at an institution that matched my criteria (location, public/private). I made clear this is where I got my salary figure from when I made this request. I actually thought they would come back meeting in the middle - particularly since that figured actually reflects all assistant faculty not just 1st year faculty but they actually met my request! I also simply asked for summer salary and was given this as well.

My advice is really don't be afraid to ask. The worst they can say is "no." They aren't going to rescind your offer because you asked for too much! The negotiations are confidential between you and the chair - the rest of the dept doesn't know what you are requesting. So its not like you will get to your dept with your colleagues thinking "Oh man - I can't believe she asked for THAT!"

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

anon8585 (guest) 05 Jan 2010 21:28

I agree with the comments below:

1. Have an excel spreadsheet listing everything you could possibly think you would want for your start-up. Don't forget to include travel to summer workshops for stats training or a psychology teaching conference. Don't inflate the numbers as they will check them. I used amazon.com for much of my pricing when possible. Teaching reductions, research assistants, and summer salarly are common items to also ask for as well.

2. It never hurts to ask for something. Worst case scenario is a "No."

3. For salarly, APA salary guide is useful. Also consult with AAUP salary information if you can get it. It lists BY INSTITUTION salarly by faculty status. It was extremely helpful for me in negotiating salarly, plus you can cite comparable universities/colleges.

Good luck!

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

vd 05 Jan 2010 21:34

The APA resources mentioned above are quite useful. In particular, Table 26 provides average starting salaries for 2008-09 and expected starting salaries for 2009-10, which provide some basis for extrapolation.

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

socialguy (guest) 26 Jan 2010 20:56

Make sure you negotiate most strongly for things that will be yours to keep (e.g., salary). Start-up, while nice, is an investment in the university. Don't get persuaded to take a lower salary in exchange for more start-up money. I know so many new faculty who make this mistake.

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

Anon (guest) 27 Jan 2010 17:54

This has been so very helpful. Unfortunately, I'm still struggling to get the salary I want. Can I get a bit more advice?

1. If they say "No" (to a salary), how should I ask again (e.g., show more data)?

2. Any tips for using the offer to get "faster" decisions from other universities where I interview?

At the end of the day, I feel lucky to have a good offer in this tough economy. So many brilliant, hard working friends are struggling way too hard. I really appreciate all the advice.

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

crossing fingers... (guest) 27 Jan 2010 19:05

Along these lines, should a poor state university be expected to match your current salary from an obviously wealthier private school? There is a ~$10,000 discrepancy between my current position (visitor at a SLAC) and a state school where I hope to get an offer (as published by AAUP). Taking a huge pay cut when going into a tenure-track position just seems kinda odd. And unpleasant!

Also, has anyone negotiated time towards tenure?

Thanks!

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

anon (guest) 27 Jan 2010 21:34

Regarding time toward tenure—the safe bet (and more common policy) is to discuss 'early tenure' options. Just ask someone to be clear what early tenure would take (e.g., 3 times as many pubs and 250K in grants) and be sure that it's a possibility. That way, you can always take the extra time if needed. Either way, they should pay you for extra experience. A 10,000 dollar difference is huge…

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

anon8585 (guest) 27 Jan 2010 20:55

It's hard negotiating salary. I had an offer this year and was unhappy with the salary. I pushed the Dean as far as I could stating things such as, "I am very thrilled at the prospect of joining the faculty at XYZ University, the salary is lower than I was expecting. I had $xx,xxx in mind," or "my current salary is $xx,xxx can you get close to it?" and lastly, "according to the AAUP salarly figures, your competition (other SLAC or R1) pays $xx,xxx can you come up from your original offer?"

My story was that I eventually turned down the position because the match and quality of life issues weren't quite right (and I was reasonably sure I had another offer in hand). I did mention that the salary was low during the conversation. At that point, after I had already declined the offer, the Dean sounded like he could have thrown in a grand or two more. So you could always try to play hardball, but becareful because they could tell you to go take a walk.

Re: Negotiating before accepting offers?

anonwithmultioffers (guest) 16 Feb 2010 17:21

The single best way to negotiate is to have multiple offers. Also, remember no matter how much you like folks ALWAYS asks for more than you think you could get.